krb
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More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/17 11:31
http://tinyurl.com/2trz8
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/17 14:08
I didn't miss his point, fatso, I disagreed with it. Completely. I listed elsewhere alternatives which are wholly unreasonable in the presence of an infectious disease. Even wringing necks first could pose additional, unnecessary risks. Transportation of infected birds could increase the risks to humans along their routes. Waiting for other forms of euthanasia is also out of the question because of the timeliness involved.
Burning them alive may seem inhumane and quite unpleasant, but it is among the quickest and safest methods. You can play like your Dr Shipman or sit around and twiddle your thumbs. Public health officials don't have time to waste appealing to methods that satisfy overweight ex-tyre changing ARAs in squatted flats in Sussex.
Strawman.
My argument was not as you allege. Stick to things you know something about. You weren't a scholar. You earned a GCE in woodwork and you tinkered with cars that had electrics problems.
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najarian
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/17 18:26
Why did you change his name to "TexMex", you racist bigot? Why do you think you're insulting him with that?
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/17 22:06
Strawman. My argument is for destroying them, period. Fire happens to be the most efficient and safest manner given the conditions in rural areas of third-world nations. Since time is of the essence in dealing with communicable diseases, I grant a bit more slack in methods employed by locals. It's not like they're ex-mechanics turned armchair logicians sitting in a cozy squatted flat, munching on crisps. They're dealing with a crisis in the real world. You're just blowing out your ass, as usual.
No, it does not. Now go bother your wife for a while before she goes to sleep.
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 02:40
You emotive and inattentive little pansy. From your own link:
"In a traditional Hindu cremation ceremony normally reserved for humans..."
No, that would increase the risk of transmission, DICKHEAD.
<snip>
Perhaps you should read of all of what you post before you open yours,
DAFThar.
<snip>
Just how would you contain the risk of transmission of avian flu, Dr
Wankhar?
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krb
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 04:55
So you'd burn a million chickens to death to save yourself a headache. Where would you draw the line?
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 05:45
<..>
*Sub* human? Your supremacist views are showing again. Have you cut eye holes in your sheet again?
The kind who doesn't like watching little kids die of avian flu.
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krb
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 08:59
What the fuck would you do besides complain about me complaining about the the cull?
They're not all infected.
How do you think the birds got on to the bonfire, walked? That's right, someone picked it up and threw them on. They TOUCHED THE "INFECTED"
BIRDS--by hand! :-0
You can't justify burning animals to death for ANY reason.
Your weak attempts in justifying it show you, as what you really are.
As I said, sweet dreams Tex.
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 09:32
<...>
No, you keep fantasizing and pontificating about farming practices rather than addressing the facts as they are.
No, shithead. That doesn't tell me what you WOULD do, just what you
WOULDN'T. What WOULD you do?
Priceless, you filthy evader. I don't care how the people affected by avian flu cull their livestock so long as they do it and keep the infection contained.
Oh jolly good, we'll send a team from the UK to carry out testing so only the infected ones are culled. Are there any tests to determine which ones actually are infected? What's the incubation period? How many healthy chickens will become infected between time of testing and separating the healthy ones from infected ones? How will you quarantine all these fucking chickens, asshole?
You know NOTHING about livestock, and ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about disease prevention in animals OR humans.
How many people does it take to throw bagged birds on a pyre? How many would it take to wring all their necks?
Why don't you try to adopt some Indonesian chickens, asswipe?
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drj75
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 10:05
1) What the fuck does a religious ceremony have to do with the meat industry?
2) How can the intentional roasting of live chickens be termed
"collateral"?
3) Moron, the purpose of a tinyurl is to REPLACE the longer url, not for some dumbass to give two links to the same webpage in one fucking post.
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krb
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 13:38
You acknowledge this yet you still consider the burning of live chickens is acceptable.
It's not utopian. It is achievable that animals are not raised in an industrial manner.
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krb
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 14:17
Ah dumdums do it.
Stop crying you little baldy fuck.
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krb
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 17:12
Burning chickens running about spreading potentially virus infected shit about is not safe.
Does the sentience of any non-human ever come into your decision making processes?
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 18:07
I already have. In an area where poisoning or gassing is possible and appropriate, then that's fine. In a poorer rural area far out from large cities, fire is appropriate. Guess which of those Indonesia and Vietnam and Thailand are.
Yes, you have by refusing to give appropriate alternatives outside your
Utopian fantasies about singing Kumbaya with diseased poultry.
I will give you one more chance to write an intelligible sentence, or to even make a bit of sense. I know it's a waste of time for both of us, but I'm a fair man like that.
I have given you a fairly conservative view of the physical limitations, the limited resources available, the gravity of the situation in terms of human and animal health, and the timeliness involved. Fire is the most appropriate method available for those culls, particularly in the instances you showed (Indonesia). If you want the chickens' necks wrung first, you can be the first British ARA volunteer to risk his own health to wring chicken necks before the diseased birds are thrown into pyres.
If you won't get off your fat, lazy arse, though, I don't see why you have any room to bitch about how the people most affected by and at risk of contracting the *70% FATAL* disease are dealing with it.
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/18 22:38
Contagion management. Stopping the spread of a lethal virus. That justifies it, ColdSore.
There ARE alternatives, including gassing. You and Racist Ray would be harping on Asians for doing that, too.
No, it's quite true. I asked you to explain what you would do to contain the spread of avian flu. You gave a Utopian spiel about not raising animals. Fine in your narrow mind where the animals and people get together to sing Kumbaya, but what about in the real world -- the one in which disease-carrying poultry are causing people to die?
It isn't mistreatment when it's done to save animal and human life. It is called contagion management, asshole.
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/19 02:45
Chickens try to escape from a fire as Indonesian villagers burn hundreds of poultry to cut the spread of bird flu near the town of Tabanan, in the central Bali island.
What do you have against cutting the spread of bird flu, Smeggy?
Ipse dixit. Tell me how you would manage this particular crisis, asshole. What options do people have? Per your link above, have you even been to Indonesia? How the fuck do you expect poor farmers and villagers to euthanize chickens "humanely" when the people are poor and the situation is a matter of life and death?
I haven't. We're not talking about places like Sussex where the government has veterinarians and officials to help out and dispense gas or chemicals. We're talking about regions in the third-world and a disease in which time is of the essence. How the hell would YOU contain a lethal contagion in a third world nation?
Do you think Vietnam or Indonesia is *anything* like Wales or the West
Country? Well, do you? Can they call vets out to administer gas or chemicals to disease carrying animals? You shit.
Not when the death rate of humans is attributable to chickens carrying the disease.
Perhaps you should understand a bit more about the world.
I offered to compare passports to see which of us has been to more places in the world, and possibly has an idea of the conditions found on
Bali, Inodesia; Thailand; Vietnam; Hong Kong; China; and wherever else this is a problem (I almost added Delaware but I don't need a passport to go there).
No, it's a reflection of my travels and what I have seen and observed and enoyed in them.
Ignorance about avian flu? Arrogance about disease management?
I think YOU are the ignorant one here. Your "method" of dealing with the problem ignores reality: people want chickens, so they raise them. You also don't seem to realize that the longer sick chickens run around, the more they can infect humans. The current death rate from infection is nearly twice that of the last outbreak in Hong Kong.
I also think you're the one who's being arrogant. You cannot offer one
*suitable* alternative for the conditions found in some places affected by this disease. It's fine to hypothesize what a wonderful world it would be if people didn't even raise chickens, but that isn't the world we already live in, is it? So fuck you and your AR views if you cannot separate the world you want from the one you're in.
Finally, I didn't say a fucking word about cultures or countries in this. The first mention was Racist Ray in calling Asians "gooks" as he's wont to do. The second was you, asshole, in raising my nationality -- which isn't an issue in this matter.
No, it's your only response when presented with facts about a disease that kills 2 out of every 3 people infected with it. Like you, it shows your moral bankruptcy and your small mind.
No, I'm sane. I want those people to live and I hope they contain the disease however they can. They don't have time to sit around wondering if the means (destroying the birds) justify the end (protecting public health). Fuck you and your twisted AR fantasies.
I've asked you repeatedly what you would do to contain it. All you've answered is fantasy drivel about, "Well, golly, they shouldn't be breeding chickens. Chickens are our friends."
Fuck off, you clown.
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human_shape
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/19 03:01
How many of those diseased chickens escape the flames, nitwit? See the pics of the people standing around to throw them back in?
Not when human life or well-being is at risk. Thanks for admitting it's not the *manner* that really bothers you. That's why you won't tell anyone what you would do differently: you think chickens are more sentient than six year-olds.
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/19 05:23
There is no end to the cruelty inflicted upon animals, in this case birds, by the lousy low life, sub human 'Gooks'
What type of person can carry out atrocious acts of this nature?
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krb
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/19 05:32
That was only part of the story. TexMex.
It was a traditional Hindu ceremony used to CULL poultry. It was a weapon, just as much as a gun would be used.
Clue: look up cull and bird flu as a start.
Perhaps you should understand a bit more about the world. But that would never do for an ignorant and arrogant American would it TexMex?
Not to breed millions of birds in an industrial setting for food, as a start.
I would not accept the methods that you seem to condone that have been used.
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krb
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re:More Collateral Suffering from the meat industry - 2005/09/19 07:44
That's not answering the question.
Nothing chickens or rabbits being more sentient than a six year old there.
You are lying AGAIN.
You need to prove that there is only one option of burning thousands of birds to death will save billions of human lives. You have not, no one has.
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